Re: Do Aliens Really Exist?

wisdominme Fri Oct 30, 2009 4:07 pm

Xolo wrote:
wisdominme wrote:
Xolo wrote:
wisdominme wrote:
Now, if you read the very first book of Genesis in the Bible, it describes what God created in the "beginning" where there was absolutely nothing.
Genesis 1:1 says, "In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth."
By reading this verse, we know that now there are "heaven and the earth" from absolutely nothing.
These are what God created on each day for 6 days:
1st day- light and darkness Genesis 1:4 - And God saw that the light was good
2nd day- sky
3rd day- the land, the sea, and the vegetation Genesis 1:10- And God saw that it was good
4th day- the sun, the moon, and the stars Genesis 1:18- And God saw that it was good
5th day- animals and birds Genesis 1:21- And God saw that it was good
6th day- Adam or Man or Human Genesis 1:31- And God saw everything that he had made, and behold, it was very good.
7th day- He rested
The underlined subjects from above are what God created. It does not mention any other beings or creatures being created other than those. And to answer your question, "You're saying he was happy with just one group?", actually He was satisfied with what He made since the Bible states that "And God saw everything that he had made, and behold, it was very good." (Genesis 1:31)

So according to the Bible, any other "beings" other than what He created, indicated above, do not exist, thus aliens do not exist.

LOL I am really laughing hard at the lack of knowledge you have.

"What are some disadvantages of religion" ------> it does not allow you to open your doors to reality.
In other words, all I'm saying is google: "Earth like planets."

Once you have googled that, you will find out that there are many other planets that may be able to sustain life, not only this, but it also proves you and the bible wrong on the point you stated.
And to answer your question, "You're saying he was happy with just one group?", actually He was satisfied with what He made since the Bible states that "And God saw everything that he had made, and behold, it was very good." (Genesis 1:31)
You are pretty much saying that he created one and only one ocean, one forest, one sky.. and all those in only one planet, our planet "Earth," so then what would you say about the Earth like planets? (who made them?)

and one last thing, if God is so powerful, why did rest on the 7th day??

First, you need to stay in intellectual safety. "LOL I am really laughing hard at the lack of knowledge you have."-Comment like this is not acceptable and is offensive. I don't feel the need to reply to a comment that breaks intellectual safety.
If you want to know what my thoughts are on your comment, please re-post your comment without the rude part, and I will be happy to share what I think on your comment! Thanx.

lol no.. im not reducing myself so I can get answers from anybody.
We either share thoughts/comments or we don't... It's that simple and I'm sorry I have to put it to you that way..

Anyhow, sorry if I sound too rude.

Why do you think apologizing for your own rude comment is reducing yourself?
Don't you realize that posting a rude comment itself is reducing your character by disrespecting and breaking the intellectual safety?
I thought we, as educated young adults, knew better than this.
And you are not getting answers from anybody, there are no answers, we are here to learn about what others think to enlarge our perceptions on things, isn't that the value of philosophy? Not disrespecting people just because they don't agree with you?
I just want you to be clear on the point of this Inquiry Forum.

wisdominme Sun Nov 01, 2009 2:15 am

Rombat wrote:Without trying to derail this thread any further, you would be bettering yourself with less offensive words, not reducing yourself.

wisdominme:
I'm not really sure how else to explain this, but I'll give it a shot.

Why do we assume the bible, written mostly ~2000 years ago is, shall we say, up to date? Maybe things have changed, possibly even so drastically as to have caused God to abandon us. Or, less pessimistically, maybe he's seen us as complete, so wants to spread the miracle of life to other Earth-like planets that he set up at the dawn of time simply to one day create life on. I mean, if we're so great, why not spread us around? Again, they could still be made in his likeness, and be exactly like us, just relocated.

The biggest point is that assuming the bible is still 100% correct is probably a bad idea. Lots of things from biblical times have changed. It's reasonable to think that even if all that is said in the bible is true, more life beyond Earth could exist, simply because time has continued. Shutting out aliens because the bible doesn't mention them is like shutting out gravity because it's not mentioned. It (possibly in the case of other life) exists, it just wasn't mentioned because it wasn't important or we weren't ready.

I can clearly see where you are coming from and I agree with you on your point that things have been changed from Biblical time to present day. But, your point on "God abandon us" is not true because He sent Jesus Christ NOT to abandon us. If He wanted to abandon us, why did He bother to sacrifice His only Son? Now, your assertion on "more life beyond Earth existing" can't be true either because 1) the Bible doesn't mention it 2) there is no scientific proof that supports life beyond Earth existing, but 3) there is scientific proof that does NOT support the existence of life beyond Earth. Let me elaborate my three reasons. First, for the first reason, most of the important creations that fill the Earth and the Universe such as light, the moon, the stars, land, water, animals, vegetations, human are mentioned in the Bible. I do agree with you that things that are not mentioned in the Bible can exist such as wind. But don't you think that the existence of another "life form" holds a great deal and importance for it to be mentioned in the Bible? If God created another "life form", why wouldn't He mention it in the Bible when every other important components of the Earth or the Universe He created are clearly mentioned in the Bible? Not being mentioned in the Bible reduces the exisiting chance of another "life form". By the way, you asserted that gravity exists, yet it is not mentioned in the Bible. Gravity is mentioned in the Bible but with a different terminology, "force."

Now, for the second and the third reason, there is no scientific proof that supports life outside of Earth exists. In fact, recent scientific proof argues against the possibility of existence of life outside of Earth. Recent scientific research says that an atmosphere rich in oxygen is the most likely source of energy for complex life to exist anywhere in the Universe. Professor Catling, who is in the science team in NASA, reported that "significant oxygen in the air and oceans is essential for the evolution of multicellular organisms, and that on Earth the time required for oxygen levels to reach a point where animals could evolve was almost four billion years. Since four billion years is almost half the anticipated life-time of our Sun, life on other planets orbiting short-lived suns may not have enough time to evolve into complex forms. This is because levels of oxygen will not have had time to develop sufficiently to support complex life, before the sun dies." Professor Catling said: "This is a major limiting factor for the evolution of life on otherwise potentially habitable planets."

Don't get me wrong, I respect your view on the existence of other life form. I am not here to challenge you or to try to change your view. I just want to have a valuable inquiry with peer thinkers Very Happy

Keta Sun Nov 01, 2009 3:19 pm

I like to believe in the existence of others in this universe.

Eclipse Mon Nov 02, 2009 3:13 pm

wisdominme wrote:I can clearly see where you are coming from and I agree with you on your point that things have been changed from Biblical time to present day. But, your point on "God abandon us" is not true because He sent Jesus Christ NOT to abandon us. If He wanted to abandon us, why did He bother to sacrifice His only Son?

Since we agree that the bible is not 100% correct (I would tend to give it very little credibility), why would Christ have to be the son of "God?" He could far more likely be a simple person who convinced others to follow him.

Rombat Mon Nov 02, 2009 3:59 pm

Eclipse wrote:
wisdominme wrote:I can clearly see where you are coming from and I agree with you on your point that things have been changed from Biblical time to present day. But, your point on "God abandon us" is not true because He sent Jesus Christ NOT to abandon us. If He wanted to abandon us, why did He bother to sacrifice His only Son?

Since we agree that the bible is not 100% correct (I would tend to give it very little credibility), why would Christ have to be the son of "God?" He could far more likely be a simple person who convinced others to follow him.

Oh hey welcome to Islam, where spiritually motivating and powerful people are known as prophets, not sons of a divine being.

Even if we were to go to the he's the son of God thing, and God sent him to be sacrificed, I took that as his "Well, this is your last chance, I'm washing my hands of you people, good luck mates" more so than his reaffirmation in his faith in us. I'm not really sure how his lack of involvement when he was so "clearly" involved in early human history can point to anything else but that he's done with us.

Also, our view of other planets is really seeing them a LONG time ago. Light doesn't travel instantly so we're only seeing planets from a long long time ago, which could really skew some results. We also can't see the ENTIRE universe, which we aren't at the center of. Who knows, maybe we're on the "inanimate" side and we just travel to another area of the universe and poof, millions of other life forms. Add to that that I'm sure there is more than one star like Sol (our sun), and I think we can safely say that while it might be difficult for life to form somewhere other than Earth, scientifically it's not impossible.

The big thing is we *don't* have all the facts, and any "proof" that it's scientifically unlikely is just speculation based on our own circumstances and what we can see in our very limited view of a universe that is mostly from billions of years before our current time. Also, while you take from that quote is "life outside of earth is impossible" I take "life outside of earth requires specific conditions that we haven't found yet".

Phoenix Mon Nov 02, 2009 6:10 pm

Rombat wrote:The big thing is we *don't* have all the facts, and any "proof" that it's scientifically unlikely is just speculation based on our own circumstances and what we can see in our very limited view of a universe that is mostly from billions of years before our current time. Also, while you take from that quote is "life outside of earth is impossible" I take "life outside of earth requires specific conditions that we haven't found yet".

Any experiment scientists have done and called "proof" are just metaphors.

"Well if this is what my experiment concluded, then this is most likely what happened when we weren't around to observe."

Granted, they're very good metaphors, but metaphors nonetheless. Think objectively. When you observe an event that mimics an experiment of another event down to the last split-millisecond, then chances are, it's the same event, or extremely similar until you can think of a different event that produces the same results.

Everything can be turned into an experiment.

Boricua Tue Nov 03, 2009 11:08 am

Phoenix wrote:If Aliens do exist, they probably have as much knowledge of us as we do of them, to be perfectly honest. Unless or government does know, but that's a discussion for a completely different thread.

How do you know that aliens do exist?

Boricua Tue Nov 03, 2009 11:26 am

Phoenix wrote:
wisdominme wrote:So according to the Bible, any other "beings" other than what He created, indicated above, do not exist, thus aliens do not exist.

Are you using this logic to say that aliens do not exist, or are you using the logic to say that Christians do not believe aliens exist? If I'm assuming your sentence in a grammatically correct manner, you've said that aliens do NOT exist only because the Bible says they don't.

You have to understand that the Old Testament was written well before anyone had any real understanding of the space outside of our atmosphere.

First of all, as a Christian myself, I do not know if aliens do exist or not. Second, "wisdominme" prior to when God created the heavens and that earth, there was something already made, as it says in Genesis 1.2: "Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters." It is said that He created the heaven and the earth, but prior to this is when the dinosaurs were alive on earth. God is a perfect God and everything that He creates is perfect. Thus, why would God create something in chaos and darkness? The reason why the earth was like this in the beginning goes back to when Lucifer was an angel of God. Lucifer wanted to be like God, so God sent him to the abyss of the earth, thus when he fell, everything in earth was destroyed and fell into darkness and chaos. Afterwards, that's when God made everything how it is again. Also, Neither in the bible does it say that God only made live here on earth, or that He didn't make live outside of earth. Although I do not know if this is true or not, like the bible says, there are mysteries that God hasn't revealed to us, and that in reality doesn't affect us if we know it or not.

Now, phoenix. Ya the old testament was written in a period that men didn't know about space or anything of that matter. But the bible is word of God that was inspired by Him for these men to write down. Is not like someone just randomly wanted to write something down and that's it, for if that was the case, how is it possible that the bible which was inscribed over a period of 2,000 years, by a lot of diverse people, in days of war and times of peace, from different parts of the world, be so perfectly cohesive? That in it self is a great marble.

Rombat Tue Nov 03, 2009 11:38 am

Boricua wrote:
Now, phoenix. Ya the old testament was written in a period that men didn't know about space or anything of that matter. But the bible is word of God that was inspired by Him for these men to write down. Is not like someone just randomly wanted to write something down and that's it, for if that was the case, how is it possible that the bible which was inscribed over a period of 2,000 years, by a lot of diverse people, in days of war and times of peace, from different parts of the world, be so perfectly cohesive? That in it self is a great marble.

Actually I'd have to put that in the "very easy" category. It's just like the oral traditions of many cultures that move throughout the world and transform into something more than they were before. The fact that it was written down just means it was easy to not lose the place that the person before you left off at.

Phoenix Tue Nov 03, 2009 1:32 pm

Boricua wrote:
Phoenix wrote:If Aliens do exist, they probably have as much knowledge of us as we do of them, to be perfectly honest. Unless or government does know, but that's a discussion for a completely different thread.

How do you know that aliens do exist?

You're projecting. I've never said with certainty that aliens exist because I understand the requirement of proof to give weight to a claim.

First of all, as a Christian myself, I do not know if aliens do exist or not.

At the risk of violating intellectual safety, how are you skeptical about the existence of alien lifeforms, but completely certain about the existence of a magical being... with a straight face?

Now, phoenix. Ya the old testament was written in a period that men didn't know about space or anything of that matter. But the bible is word of God that was inspired by Him for these men to write down. Is not like someone just randomly wanted to write something down and that's it, for if that was the case, how is it possible that the bible which was inscribed over a period of 2,000 years, by a lot of diverse people, in days of war and times of peace, from different parts of the world, be so perfectly cohesive? That in it self is a great marble.

Like I said above, I don't understand how you can hold the position of a skeptic with things that have tangible proof; evolution, the rest of the universe; but be completely 100% certain about your god's existence, and use textbook LOGIC based off a book that wouldn't even be in the same ball field as certain.

Eclipse Tue Nov 03, 2009 4:01 pm

Boricua wrote:But the bible is word of God that was inspired by Him for these men to write down. Is not like someone just randomly wanted to write something down and that's it, for if that was the case, how is it possible that the bible which was inscribed over a period of 2,000 years, by a lot of diverse people, in days of war and times of peace, from different parts of the world, be so perfectly cohesive? That in it self is a great marble.

Actually, a much more logical idea would be the Bible was written so they would gain power and a following regardless of the existence of a "god." Just because more people believe it than other religious text, especially after Christians persecuted and killed anyone who disagreed with them with fanatical devotion, only lend to the idea that they brainwash people at a young age to think that the Bible is the word of "god." From what you've said on multiple topics, you seem to fall into this category.

Boricua Tue Nov 03, 2009 11:36 pm

Eclipse wrote:
Boricua wrote:But the bible is word of God that was inspired by Him for these men to write down. Is not like someone just randomly wanted to write something down and that's it, for if that was the case, how is it possible that the bible which was inscribed over a period of 2,000 years, by a lot of diverse people, in days of war and times of peace, from different parts of the world, be so perfectly cohesive? That in it self is a great marble.

Actually, a much more logical idea would be the Bible was written so they would gain power and a following regardless of the existence of a "god." Just because more people believe it than other religious text, especially after Christians persecuted and killed anyone who disagreed with them with fanatical devotion, only lend to the idea that they brainwash people at a young age to think that the Bible is the word of "god." From what you've said on multiple topics, you seem to fall into this category.

So what you're saying is that I was brainwashed into believing what I believe by someone who wrote something long ago just because they wanted power? and that I will kill anyone that goes against me?

Boricua Wed Nov 04, 2009 12:01 am

Phoenix wrote:
Boricua wrote:
Phoenix wrote:If Aliens do exist, they probably have as much knowledge of us as we do of them, to be perfectly honest. Unless or government does know, but that's a discussion for a completely different thread.

How do you know that aliens do exist?

You're projecting. I've never said with certainty that aliens exist because I understand the requirement of proof to give weight to a claim.

First of all, as a Christian myself, I do not know if aliens do exist or not.

At the risk of violating intellectual safety, how are you skeptical about the existence of alien lifeforms, but completely certain about the existence of a magical being... with a straight face?

Now, phoenix. Ya the old testament was written in a period that men didn't know about space or anything of that matter. But the bible is word of God that was inspired by Him for these men to write down. Is not like someone just randomly wanted to write something down and that's it, for if that was the case, how is it possible that the bible which was inscribed over a period of 2,000 years, by a lot of diverse people, in days of war and times of peace, from different parts of the world, be so perfectly cohesive? That in it self is a great marble.

Like I said above, I don't understand how you can hold the position of a skeptic with things that have tangible proof; evolution, the rest of the universe; but be completely 100% certain about your god's existence, and use textbook LOGIC based off a book that wouldn't even be in the same ball field as certain.

I don't believe in a magical being, such as a leprechaun or fairy, I believe in the Almighty God. Second, the reason why I'm skeptical about the existence of aliens is that there is no such proof of it, neither scientifically nor biblical, but its something that logically I cannot expel as false. Second, I have all the evidence that I need to have believe in God in the first place. I was one an athiest, and I converted because of the evidence I have personally witness and experience on my own. I don't expect for you to take my evidence as real, for I once didn't do so myself when I was an athiest. But later, I had an experience with God that made me realize that God is real and that we are nothing without Him.

Eclipse Wed Nov 04, 2009 12:06 pm

Boricua wrote:So what you're saying is that I was brainwashed into believing what I believe by someone who wrote something long ago just because they wanted power? and that I will kill anyone that goes against me?

Essentially, yes, without the killing. Thankfully, rationality is prevailing and fewer people are so radically religious ideas about killing those who disagree. You seem to be on a path of blissful ignorance, and follow exactly what people in power tell you. That is dangerous in a society where rationality is prized.

karinaf Wed Nov 04, 2009 2:03 pm

Aliens probably do exist. The universe is so big how can we disprove that aliens dont exist. We are limited to where we travel in space so there are parts of space that is yet to be discovered. I wouldn't be surprised if there was another life form.

Boricua Wed Nov 04, 2009 3:57 pm

Eclipse wrote:
Boricua wrote:So what you're saying is that I was brainwashed into believing what I believe by someone who wrote something long ago just because they wanted power? and that I will kill anyone that goes against me?

Essentially, yes, without the killing. Thankfully, rationality is prevailing and fewer people are so radically religious ideas about killing those who disagree. You seem to be on a path of blissful ignorance, and follow exactly what people in power tell you. That is dangerous in a society where rationality is prized.

People in power? No one ever forced me to believe what I believe, specially someone in "power". I came to believe on my own account. It wasn't like someone told me "believe it or else". I came to that decision on my own based on my personal experience.

Boricua Wed Nov 04, 2009 4:00 pm

karinaf wrote:Aliens probably do exist. The universe is so big how can we disprove that aliens dont exist. We are limited to where we travel in space so there are parts of space that is yet to be discovered. I wouldn't be surprised if there was another life form.

And you're probably right, alien might exist. But as you said, we cannot know because we lack knowledge of what is beyond our own galaxy. But at the end, we will see if there are or not aliens.

Eclipse Wed Nov 04, 2009 6:35 pm

Boricua wrote:
Eclipse wrote:
Boricua wrote:So what you're saying is that I was brainwashed into believing what I believe by someone who wrote something long ago just because they wanted power? and that I will kill anyone that goes against me?

Essentially, yes, without the killing. Thankfully, rationality is prevailing and fewer people are so radically religious ideas about killing those who disagree. You seem to be on a path of blissful ignorance, and follow exactly what people in power tell you. That is dangerous in a society where rationality is prized.

People in power? No one ever forced me to believe what I believe, specially someone in "power". I came to believe on my own account. It wasn't like someone told me "believe it or else". I came to that decision on my own based on my personal experience.

You believe what the Bible says without independent thought that is the very definition of a follower. Power is relative, and you give power to a book to dominate your life. You may not have turned to religion by force, but out of fear of the world. Some do that, and there is a reason Freud said religion is for the weak-minded. They cannot stand to be in the real world, so they cling to a notion that they can live forever if they believe something. People are so afraid of death; they'll be duped into anything if they could live forever.

Boricua Wed Nov 04, 2009 7:33 pm

Eclipse wrote:
Boricua wrote:
Eclipse wrote:
Boricua wrote:So what you're saying is that I was brainwashed into believing what I believe by someone who wrote something long ago just because they wanted power? and that I will kill anyone that goes against me?

Essentially, yes, without the killing. Thankfully, rationality is prevailing and fewer people are so radically religious ideas about killing those who disagree. You seem to be on a path of blissful ignorance, and follow exactly what people in power tell you. That is dangerous in a society where rationality is prized.

People in power? No one ever forced me to believe what I believe, specially someone in "power". I came to believe on my own account. It wasn't like someone told me "believe it or else". I came to that decision on my own based on my personal experience.

You believe what the Bible says without independent thought that is the very definition of a follower. Power is relative, and you give power to a book to dominate your life. You may not have turned to religion by force, but out of fear of the world. Some do that, and there is a reason Freud said religion is for the weak-minded. They cannot stand to be in the real world, so they cling to a notion that they can live forever if they believe something. People are so afraid of death; they'll be duped into anything if they could live forever.

A book doesn't dominate my life, God does. I didn't turn to Christianity because of fear, but rather, because of the encounter I had with God. I don't believe in God because I'm weak-minded, I do so because I know that God is there, because He has shown me the truth. I am not afraid of death, although I was prior to becoming a Christian, but that is not the reason why I converted. You don't become a believer for what God can do for you, but what you are in God.

Eclipse Wed Nov 04, 2009 10:18 pm

Boricua wrote:
Eclipse wrote:
Boricua wrote:
Eclipse wrote:
Boricua wrote:So what you're saying is that I was brainwashed into believing what I believe by someone who wrote something long ago just because they wanted power? and that I will kill anyone that goes against me?

Essentially, yes, without the killing. Thankfully, rationality is prevailing and fewer people are so radically religious ideas about killing those who disagree. You seem to be on a path of blissful ignorance, and follow exactly what people in power tell you. That is dangerous in a society where rationality is prized.

People in power? No one ever forced me to believe what I believe, specially someone in "power". I came to believe on my own account. It wasn't like someone told me "believe it or else". I came to that decision on my own based on my personal experience.

You believe what the Bible says without independent thought that is the very definition of a follower. Power is relative, and you give power to a book to dominate your life. You may not have turned to religion by force, but out of fear of the world. Some do that, and there is a reason Freud said religion is for the weak-minded. They cannot stand to be in the real world, so they cling to a notion that they can live forever if they believe something. People are so afraid of death; they'll be duped into anything if they could live forever.

A book doesn't dominate my life, God does. I didn't turn to Christianity because of fear, but rather, because of the encounter I had with God. I don't believe in God because I'm weak-minded, I do so because I know that God is there, because He has shown me the truth. I am not afraid of death, although I was prior to becoming a Christian, but that is not the reason why I converted. You don't become a believer for what God can do for you, but what you are in God.

So a hallucination told you to follow everything a book said? You may not like to admit it, but fear is what begets all religions. Everyone fears death because it's part of natural selection, but I'll not lie to myself into thinking there is some way to live forever. Enjoy your time here, because it's all you got.

Boricua Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:59 pm

Eclipse wrote:
So a hallucination told you to follow everything a book said? You may not like to admit it, but fear is what begets all religions. Everyone fears death because it's part of natural selection, but I'll not lie to myself into thinking there is some way to live forever. Enjoy your time here, because it's all you got.

A hallucination? Good one! But far as I'm concern I don't do drugs, have a mental illness or stress, for me to hallucinate something like this. Even if I had, I'm pretty I wouldnt have one almost every single day of my life. Thats kind of a serious thing if I did and I should get in touch with my doctor.

Also, how can one lie to themselves? And ya, you're right, I will enjoy my time here on earth, for it only comes one. But I will then enjoy my life in heaven for eternity.

Eclipse Thu Nov 05, 2009 12:07 am

Boricua wrote:
Eclipse wrote:
So a hallucination told you to follow everything a book said? You may not like to admit it, but fear is what begets all religions. Everyone fears death because it's part of natural selection, but I'll not lie to myself into thinking there is some way to live forever. Enjoy your time here, because it's all you got.

A hallucination? Good one! But far as I'm concern I don't do drugs, have a mental illness or stress, for me to hallucinate something like this. Even if I had, I'm pretty I wouldnt have one almost every single day of my life. Thats kind of a serious thing if I did and I should get in touch with my doctor.

Also, how can one lie to themselves? And ya, you're right, I will enjoy my time here on earth, for it only comes one. But I will then enjoy my life in heaven for eternity.

You said it, not me. But I can see religion as a kind of disease.

Nothing lives forever, it's one of the universal laws: death and taxes.

Boricua Thu Nov 05, 2009 12:39 am

Eclipse wrote:
Boricua wrote:
Eclipse wrote:
So a hallucination told you to follow everything a book said? You may not like to admit it, but fear is what begets all religions. Everyone fears death because it's part of natural selection, but I'll not lie to myself into thinking there is some way to live forever. Enjoy your time here, because it's all you got.

A hallucination? Good one! But far as I'm concern I don't do drugs, have a mental illness or stress, for me to hallucinate something like this. Even if I had, I'm pretty I wouldnt have one almost every single day of my life. Thats kind of a serious thing if I did and I should get in touch with my doctor.

Also, how can one lie to themselves? And ya, you're right, I will enjoy my time here on earth, for it only comes one. But I will then enjoy my life in heaven for eternity.

You said it, not me. But I can see religion as a kind of disease.

Nothing lives forever, it's one of the universal laws: death and taxes.

Lets go back to what you said, "universal laws". What need does nature have to not only make laws, but also to abide by it? And what an interesting thing that these laws are really quite perfect. And another thing, why is it that nature, the universe, and everything we see around us, us ruled by numbers?

And you're right, our body doesn't live forever. But our spirit sure does.

Eclipse Thu Nov 05, 2009 12:05 pm

Boricua wrote:
Eclipse wrote:
Boricua wrote:
Eclipse wrote:
So a hallucination told you to follow everything a book said? You may not like to admit it, but fear is what begets all religions. Everyone fears death because it's part of natural selection, but I'll not lie to myself into thinking there is some way to live forever. Enjoy your time here, because it's all you got.

A hallucination? Good one! But far as I'm concern I don't do drugs, have a mental illness or stress, for me to hallucinate something like this. Even if I had, I'm pretty I wouldnt have one almost every single day of my life. Thats kind of a serious thing if I did and I should get in touch with my doctor.

Also, how can one lie to themselves? And ya, you're right, I will enjoy my time here on earth, for it only comes one. But I will then enjoy my life in heaven for eternity.

You said it, not me. But I can see religion as a kind of disease.

Nothing lives forever, it's one of the universal laws: death and taxes.

Lets go back to what you said, "universal laws". What need does nature have to not only make laws, but also to abide by it? And what an interesting thing that these laws are really quite perfect. And another thing, why is it that nature, the universe, and everything we see around us, us ruled by numbers?

And you're right, our body doesn't live forever. But our spirit sure does.

We, in our limited knowledge of the world and universe, simplify the randomness with which nature has organized itself into a seemingly perfect system. We call them laws because nothing can completely defy them, least of all a magical godfather.

Spirit? Care to explain how we have such an illogical thing? We have consciousness, but no spirit or soul. That's just another part of an elaborate lie to enslave people to the idea of "god" and a religion.

Rombat Thu Nov 05, 2009 6:20 pm

Boricua wrote:
Eclipse wrote:
So a hallucination told you to follow everything a book said? You may not like to admit it, but fear is what begets all religions. Everyone fears death because it's part of natural selection, but I'll not lie to myself into thinking there is some way to live forever. Enjoy your time here, because it's all you got.

A hallucination? Good one! But far as I'm concern I don't do drugs, have a mental illness or stress, for me to hallucinate something like this. Even if I had, I'm pretty I wouldnt have one almost every single day of my life. Thats kind of a serious thing if I did and I should get in touch with my doctor.

Also, how can one lie to themselves? And ya, you're right, I will enjoy my time here on earth, for it only comes one. But I will then enjoy my life in heaven for eternity.

Many things besides mental illness or drugs can cause a hallucination. Not even saying that's how you've come in contact with god, just noting that hallucinations have many different sources.

As a side note: you should really tell us your contact story.

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